Dear Giancarlo

I hope you are fine.

It is a long time ago (2004) that I said (since the begginning) that it
was important to harmonize concepts, to create the taxonomy and to
analyse commom data.

After business technical group COREP and COREP have created COREP framework
during two years, I believed, with CEBS´s approval in 2006, that it would
be a framework, a taxonomy and some more small national extensions and
small taxonomies.

It seemed to be an octopus with its several arms, but the head was only
one. The CORE and friends.The main taxonomy and some litlle extensions...

And a lot of trainning in the Worshops because it was importantant to
involve business people with IT people to work harder and better.

What we can see now. Well, you know.... And some presentations don´t help
to gain confidence in XBRL. By the contrary, help the mess with existencial
doubts ( I know that I can realize my project with XBRL, but I don´t
really know how yet ....)

How many times CEBS invited formally supervisory authorities/ Central Banks
for the Worshops? One or two I presume...

Why business people aren´t enough involved? For many reasons all we
know....

1)Do not exist an harmonized reporting format. Who needs a standard, when
the templates are not standard.? Who bets in a "young promissory horse" in
the races, when we are sure about the qualities about the normal winner?
2) XBRL is a new tool " in constrution" with difficulties," with
potential risk" presented as a IT tool (advantages are not to recognized)
3) Business people don´t understand XBRL as well and how to work with
tools, the formulae, the versions and so on.
4) Business people don´t have time to create a taxonomy or an instance
document due... to time, for practice. ( Workshop could be a great
opportunity to involve bussiness people to do something; a practical
trainning day or days wil be a good choice).
5) How many business supervisors knows, how to work with the taxonomies and
the instance documents to motivated them to continue?
5) In this stage, or we work all day with XBRL or we are a part time
player, more or less involved, with live behind XBRL that must be done
first.
.
By one hand, XBRL is not mandatory . Everybody has freedom of choice and
choose what they want. Choose stability and don´t change it ( winds of
change are not good). Choose what it is functioning against possible good
revolucionary ideas in the theory, but not yet implemented in practice.

By other hand, it is not easy to "build" a "building" (" taxonomy") when
who knows that needs 10 floors (business people) is confronted by other
people ( IT people) that due money, human resources, outsoursing costs and
so on, can postpone or exclude other relevants buildings ( other relevants
projects) in the next years, sepecially when the advantages by the
reporting aren´t so relevants.

One believer working/producing taxonomies in free time to show the
contrary?Seems difficult.

Unless CEBS, European Commission or else, forces the obligation, what
doesn´t seem to be "polite" for people against XBRL because can be
considered as political decision.

Friday, I was in a COREP ON meeting. It is important to harmonise
contents and reporting formats and at this momment we know CEBS´s desires
but it is not easy as I confirmed.

Nice week

Best regards,

António José G. D. Gonçalves
( in a personal opinion)


António José G. D. Gonçalves
Banco de Portugal
DSB - AEAI
Phone : 351 21 3130534
E-mail: Antonio.Goncalves.Domingos@...



"Pellizzari
Giancarlo (Dexia
Group)" To
<giancarlo.pelliz <XBRL-FINREP@yahoogroups.com>,
zari@...> "COREP"
Sent by: <XBRL-COREP@yahoogroups.com>
XBRL-COREP@yahoog cc
roups.com
Subject
[XBRL-COREP] RE: [XBRL-FINREP]
10/10/2008 10:07 FINREP/COREP: Minutes of
COREP/FINREP Conference call on 8th
October 2008
Please respond to
XBRL-COREP@yahoog
roups.com












Dear all,



Just a comment on the minutes...

It is a long time ago that I said it is important that people from the business
participate
in the taxonomies development. For the moment, we saw from the industry side:
Fortis,
Santander, BBVA and Dexia. From CEBS business people ? None... If you want to
attract more
people from the industry, you need to make common meeting with a clear
involvment from the
business people at CEBS, i.e. the EGFI.

There is a meeting foreseen on the 30th of October. Only one point will deal
with XBRL: "
Representatives of CEBS’ XBRL network will present the proposals for
standardising the
reporting at IT level"... and it is IT focussed. I don't know how, but it is
important for
business people to undertand why XBRL is not just an IT stuff.

I remember when we created the first FINREP taxonomy. We were just 4 : Jacobo
Varela,
Patrick Amis, Mark Creemers and I => 3 "pure" from the business and 1 "mixed"
business-IT...

THe message that people from the business should understand is that XBRL is not
only a way
to harmonise IT procedures, it is first of all a way to harmonise reporting
formats.


Best regards,


Giancarlo Pellizzari
Head of Prudential Policy

Dexia Holding s.a.
Dexia Tower
Place Rogier 11
1210 Brussels
Belgium
Tel +32 2 213 50 49
Fax +32 2 213 57 80
Mob +32 477 871 857
www.dexia.com

P Please consider your environmental responsibility before printing this
e-mail

From: XBRL-FINREP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:XBRL-FINREP@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Colm O
hAonghusa
Sent: jeudi 9 octobre 2008 23:08
To: COREP; FINREP
Subject: [XBRL-FINREP] FINREP/COREP: Minutes of COREP/FINREP Conference call on
8th October
2008





Ignacio Boixo (Bank of Spain)


Bernard Darrius (Bank of France)


Ignacio Hernández-Ros (Reporting Standard)


Colm O hAonghusa


Javi Mora (XBRL Spain)


Maciej Piechocki (IASCF)


Michele Romanelli (Bank of Italy)


Jerome Poupard (Bank of France)



Apologies
Victor Morilla Bank of Spain
Mark Creemers (NBB)


Katrin Schmehl (Bundesbank)



Agenda:


1. COREP and FINREP taxonomies.


Virtually the whole call, which lasted almost an hour, centered around a wide
ranging and
detailed discussion on the need to design a methodology to synchronise FINREP
with each new
IFRS taxonomy. The paper circulated earlier by IHR was discussed: it needs a
broader focus
to highlight more clearly, with simple examples, the business user issues that
are critical
to this topic. There is a urgent need for the business users to actively engage
in this
process: they are the ultimate beneficiaries of the outcome and the problems
cannot be
resolved without their active involvement. This will be discussed again next
week


As noted earlier the proposed workshop in Madrid on 6th & 7th Nov has been
cancelled.


2. Formulas, Versioning, and Best Practices.


No update


3. IX European Banking Supervisors XBRL Workshop – Presentations available on
COREP
website.


For information.


4. 18th XBRL International Conference – October 15th-16th, Washington, DC


Papers being finalised


5. Banking Industry meeting - October 30th, London


For information


6. AOB


The 'cost of attendance by banking supervisors' issue emanating from the
running of the X
th CEB's workshop in // with the 19th XII Int Conference in Paris next summer
has been
resolved.






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