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Sigh. I wish there was some way to stop this. Another list i belong to gets
these all the time. And they all come from the same IP address.

Judy


>From: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com Reply-To:
>contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com
>To: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com Subject: [contrarianlibrarian] New
>file uploaded to contrarianlibrarian
>Date: 7 Dec 2003 09:28:21 -0000
>
>
>Hello,
>
>This email message is a notification to let you know that
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>group.
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>
>You can access this file at the URL
>
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20review%20site
>
>To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit
>
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>
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>
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>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Hi Everyone:

I've lurked long enough. :)I hope someone on the list might have
some insight to offer me. I'm a new graduate (B.A -Literature) and
still waiting for news from the admissions office about the MLS
program at Texas Woman's Uni. I'm questioning whether to do dual
degrees (M.A.- Lit & MLS) because after reading the entirity of this
list, frankly, I'm worried about job opportunities and the
situations I'll encounter once I'm a librarian.

Certainly an extra degree can't hurt, but is the tuition and time
worth it? In your opinion? Will I be any more competitive or have
any more options as a librarian with an additional masters in
literature? Do I understand correctly that it will help me obtain a
position in an acadmic library? What about public or private?

I live south of houston and the only good comment I've run across on
various online lists regards one local, public library (Baytown).
Can anyone recommend any other public libraries? I'm in between
Galveston and Houston... I don't want to even try Houston PL and I'm
wondering about Harris County...

So many questions. Thanks to anyone with any advice.

Take care and Merry Christmas,
L

The extra degree is more useful if you want to be an academic librarian or a
special librarian. Otherwise it doesn't seem to matter much.

If you are willing to move and flexible on the type of library, then there
are jobs, especially in rural areas.

I had always planned to be a small town public librarian. Now I'm a small
town academic librarian (for all of 8 months). I'm happy for now, but we'll
see after I've spent winter here. (I came from Southern California)

JudyA
Tillamook Or


>From: "Laurie" <pharuik2@...>

>
>Hi Everyone:
>
>I've lurked long enough. :)I hope someone on the list might have
>some insight to offer me. I'm a new graduate (B.A -Literature) and
>still waiting for news from the admissions office about the MLS
>program at Texas Woman's Uni. I'm questioning whether to do dual
>degrees (M.A.- Lit & MLS) because after reading the entirity of this
>list, frankly, I'm worried about job opportunities and the
>situations I'll encounter once I'm a librarian.
>
>Certainly an extra degree can't hurt, but is the tuition and time
>worth it? In your opinion? Will I be any more competitive or have
>any more options as a librarian with an additional masters in
>literature? Do I understand correctly that it will help me obtain a
>position in an acadmic library? What about public or private?
>
>I live south of houston and the only good comment I've run across on
>various online lists regards one local, public library (Baytown).
>Can anyone recommend any other public libraries? I'm in between
>Galveston and Houston... I don't want to even try Houston PL and I'm
>wondering about Harris County...
>
>So many questions. Thanks to anyone with any advice.
>
>Take care and Merry Christmas,
>L
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>contrarianlibrarian-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
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If you are looking for that perfect Christmas gift for your favorite
librarian (you of course), check out

www.cafeshops.com/vavlibrarian

JudyA

Some posters have (rightly) expressed concern about the occasional
spam that appears on this group.  Unfortunately, I haven't found an
easy way to prevent it without making it more difficult to post
anonymously.  Since maintaining anonymity is a priority here, I'm
afraid we'll have to put up with the occasional spam.

XB

Here is a link for any Librarians interested in preserving the
privacy of users in the shadow of the Patriot Act.

http://1115952931/stealth/librarians.html

Two months now, and the guy has not been back.
Perhaps he is laughing now as a $200/hr French
styliste cuts his hair while he sits in his corporate
jacuzzi.  And I am still working the circ desk, in
what is still a very rough, very lowest lowest common
denominator sort of place.  Vive la bibliotheque.

--- Xavier Bullwinkle <xward7@...> wrote:
> --- In contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com, Thomas
> Roche
> <tertullianus_2000@y...> wrote:
> >
> > This community is a very rough, very lowest lowest
> > common denominator sort of place.  Last week we
> had a
> > mentally disturbed street person use the
> circulation
> > department public scissors, chained to the front
> desk,
> > to give himself a haircut.
>
> Did you get some pictures of this?  They should come
> in handy when
> the mds person gets a new job (with his new 'do'),
> and quickly
> becomes a Fortune 500 CEO.
>
> Just another example of "libraries changing lives!"
>
> XB
>
>


__________________________________
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All PLs I worked in had a handful of problem users (violent, scary,
smelly) who were homeless and would take off in the winter to keep
from freezing to death.

If you are indeed in a cold area, that could be where he went to.

So, during the Spring Thaw, don't be surprised to see him back again,
refreshed and re-energized, ready to spread terror and hostility
again.

Good luck.

--- xapquet <xapquet@...> wrote:
> All PLs I worked in had a handful of problem users
> (violent, scary,
> smelly) who were homeless and would take off in the
> winter to keep
> from freezing to death.
>
> If you are indeed in a cold area, that could be
> where he went to.
>

Well, it is mighty cold tonight.

> So, during the Spring Thaw, don't be surprised to
> see him back again,
> refreshed and re-energized, ready to spread terror
> and hostility
> again.
>
Does anyone have strategies for dealing with hostile
or unbalanced-acting mentally ill patrons in PLs?  We
have recently been visited on several occasions by a
guy who is living in a parallel universe, and, quite
frankly, whose behavior is genuinely frightening.

> Good luck.
>
Thank you.
>
>
>


__________________________________
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Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes
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Today's Atlanta Journal/Constitution announces the
settlement of the reverse discrimination lawsuit
against the library director and the (then) chairman
of the library board.  The original jury award was
$23.3 million, then reduced to $16.6 million.  But
interest has been accruing at the rate of $1000/day.
The lawyers will take their 33.3% leaving around 12
million to be split among the 8 plaintiffs.

Apparently the settlement took place just before the
Supreme Court was about to decide whether or not to
hear the case -- and the County didn't have confidence
in its own argument, so they capitulated.

The only remaining question, how long can the director
at Atlanta last ?


__________________________________
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Date Posted: 16:13:21 1/08/04 Thur
Author: T. Clarice
Subject: Invest $6.00, I did, only for honest people


Dear future millionaires,

How much money do you want to make in the following months? May be
$50,000 or $100,000. Well now you have the opportunity to get into an
amazing program that can bring you huge rewards and LOTS OF FAST AND
EASY MONEY!!! You can be making thousands and thousands of dollars in
just a few weeks and it will only take you an insignificant
investment and a few minutes of your time.
A national TV channel recently dedicated a program to explain how
this business works and how it can make many persons to become rich
FAST AND EASY!!!
It also stated that there are no laws prohibiting it, and it gave
several testimonials about people that have already made fortunes on
the Mail Order System. One of them was a 15 year old boy which
parents found $71,000 hidden in his closet. He at last confessed that
he wasn?t on drugs or anything, he didn?t steal the money either. He
said that he simply joined a program that he found on the internet.
I think that reading the information bellow could have a big impact
on your overall income, so read it carefully and follow the
instructions exactly as specified.
MAKE EASY AND QUICK CASH MONEY by doing almost nothing (NO JOKE, NO
SCAM, AND VERY LEGAL) Please read on! You will be very thankful you
did! A little while back, I was browsing through newsgroups, just
like you are now, and came across an article similar to this that
said you could make thousands of dollars within weeks with only an
initial investment of $6.00! So I thought," Yeah, right, this must be
a scam", but like most of us, I was curious, so I kept reading.
Anyway, it said that you send $1.00 to each of the 6 names and
address stated in the article. You then place your own name and
address in the bottom of the list at #6, and post the article in at
least 200 newsgroups. (There are thousands) No catch, that was it.
So after thinking it over, and talking to a few people first, I
thought about trying it. I figured what have I got to lose except 6
stamps and $6.00, right? Like most of us I was a little skeptical and
a little worried about the legal aspects of it all. So I checked it
out with the U.S. Post Office (1-800-725-2161) and they confirmed
that it is indeed legal! Then I invested the measly $6.00. Well GUESS
WHAT!!... Within 7 days, I started getting money in the mail! I was
shocked! I figured it would end soon, but the money just kept coming
in. In my first week, I made about $25.00. By the end of the second
week I had made a total of over $1,000.00! In the third week I had
over $10,000.00 and it's still growing. This is now my fourth week
and I have made a total of just over $42,000.00 and it's still coming
in rapidly. It's certainly worth $6.00, and 6 stamps, I have spent
more than that on the lottery!! Let me tell you how this works and
most importantly, why it works.... also, make sure you print a copy
of this article NOW, so you can get the information off of it as you
need it.
STEP 1 Get 6 separate pieces of paper and write the following on each
piece of paper "PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST." Now get 6 US
$1.00 bills and place ONE inside EACH of the 6 pieces of paper so the
bill will not be seen through the envelope to prevent thievery. Next,
place one paper in each of the 6 envelopes and seal them. You should
now have 6 sealed envelopes, each with a piece of paper stating the
above phrase, your name and address, and a $1.00 bill. What you are
doing is creating a service by this. THIS IS ABSOLUTELY LEGAL! This
program remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of
the participants. Please continue its success by carefully adhering
to the instructions. You will now become part of the Mail Order
business. Your product is simply a service of helping develop mail
lists.
Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses:


#1] R Marshall 1194 Oceanaire San Luis Obispo, CA 93405

#2] Mike 384 Remy Ave. Mansfield, Ohio 44902

#3] R Gibson 201 Blackwood Clementon Rd 603. Lindenwold, NJ 08021

#4] S Bowser 1007 NNW Loop 323 Apt 258 Tyler,TX 75702

#5] A. Martinez 315 Bellevue Dr. Round Lake Park,IL 60073

#6] T. Clarice  P.O. Box 5104  Kahului,  Hi 96733

STEP 2 Now take the #1 name and address off the list that you see
above, move the other names up (6 becomes 5, 5 becomes 4, etc...) and
add YOUR Name and address as number 6 on the list. STEP 3 Change
anything you need to, but try to keep this article as close to
original as possible. Now, post your amended article to at least 200
newsgroups. (I think there are close to 24,000 groups) All you need
is 200, but remember, the more you post, the more money you make! ---
DIRECTIONS-----HOW TO POST TO NEWSGROUPS------------
Step 1) You do not need to re-type this entire letter to do your own
posting. Simply put your cursor at the beginning of this letter and
drag your cursor to the bottom of this document, and select 'copy'
from the edit menu. This will copy the entire letter into the
computers memory.
Step 2) Open a blank 'notepad' file and place your cursor at the top
of the blank page. From the 'edit' menu select 'paste'. This will
paste a copy of the letter into notepad so that you can add your name
to the list.
Step 3) Save your new notepad file as a .txt file. If you want to do
your postings in different sittings, you'll always have this file to
go back to.
Step 4) Use Netscape or Internet explorer and try searching for
various newsgroups (on-line forums, message boards, chat sites,
discussions.)
Step 5) Visit these message boards and post this article as a new
message by highlighting the text of this letter and selecting paste
from the edit menu. Fill in the Subject, this will be the header that
everyone sees as they scroll through the list of postings in a
particular group, click the post message button. You're done with
your first one! Congratulations...THAT'S IT! All you have to do is
jump to different newsgroups and post away, after you get the hang of
it, it will take about 30 seconds for each newsgroup! **REMEMBER, THE
MORE NEWSGROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY YOU WILL MAKE!! BUT YOU
HAVE TO POST A MINIMUM OF 200** That's it!
You will begin receiving money from around the world within days! You
may eventually want to rent a P.O. Box due to the large amount of
mail you will receive. If you wish to stay anonymous, you can invent
a name to use, as long as the postman will deliver it. **JUST MAKE
SURE ALL THE ADDRESSES ARE CORRECT.** Now the WHY part Out of 200
postings, say I receive only 5 replies (a very low example). So then
I made $5.00 with my name and address at #6 on the letter. Now, each
of the 5 persons who just sent me $1.00 make the MINIMUM 200
postings, each with my name and address at #5 and only 5 persons
respond to each of the original 5, that is another $25.00 for me, now
those 25 each make 200 MINIMUM posts with my name and address at #4
and only 5 replies each, I will bring in an additional $125.00! Now,
those 125 persons turn around and post the MINIMUM 200 with my name
and address at #3 and only receive 5 replies each, I will make an
additional $626.00! OK, now here is the fun part, each of those 625
persons post a MINIMUM 200 letters with my name and address at #2 and
they each only receive 5 replies, that just made me $3,125.00!!!
Those 3,125 persons will all deliver this message to 200 newsgroups
with my name and address at #1 and if still 5 persons per 200
newsgroups react I will receive $15,625,00! With an original
investment of only $6.00! AMAZING! When your name is no longer on the
list, you just take the latest posting in the newsgroups, and send
out another $6.00 to names on the list, putting your name at number 6
again. And start posting again.
The thing to remember is, do you realize that thousands of people all
over the world are joining the internet and reading these articles
everyday, JUST LIKE YOU are now!! So can you afford $6.00 and see if
it really works?? I think so... People have said, "what if the plan
is played out and no one sends you the money? So what! What are the
chances of that happening when there are tons of new honest users and
new honest people who are joining the internet and newsgroups
everyday and are willing to give it a try? Estimates are at 20,000 to
50,000 new users, every day, with thousands of those joining the
actual internet. Remember, play FAIRLY and HONESTLY and this will
work. ALSO REMEMBER*** : : SEND YOUR $1 OUT TO EVERYONE ON THE
LIST, : : EVEN IF THEY ARE NOT FROM THE U.S. : : WHAT ARE YOU WAITING
FOR??? : : : : GOOD LUCK!! go to google.com and search for MAKE MONEY
FAST AND EASY$$ and you will find alot of message boards !MAKE MONEY
FAST AND EASY$$

This is an illegal pyramid scheme, but I bet you all knew that.

JudyA


>From: claricefax <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
>Reply-To: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com
>To: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [contrarianlibrarian] Invest $6.00, I did, only for honest people
>Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2004 06:50:27 -0000
>
>Date Posted: 16:13:21 1/08/04 Thur
>Author: T. Clarice
>Subject: Invest $6.00, I did, only for honest people
>
>
>Dear future millionaires,
>
>How much money do you want to make in the following months? May be
>$50,000 or $100,000. Well now you have the opportunity to get into an
>amazing program that can bring you huge rewards and LOTS OF FAST AND

_________________________________________________________________
Working moms: Find helpful tips here on managing kids, home, work —  and
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--- In contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com, claricefax
<no_reply@y...> wrote:
> Date Posted: 16:13:21 1/08/04 Thur
> Author: T. Clarice
> Subject: Invest $6.00, I did, only for honest people
>
>
> Dear future millionaires,

Um, I think you have the wrong group.  I don't think too many
of us here are accustomed to being addressed as future
millionaires.

> How much money do you want to make in the following months?
> Maybe $50,000 or $100,000. Well now you have the opportunity
> to get into an amazing program that can bring you huge
> rewards and LOTS OF FAST AND EASY MONEY!!! You can be making
> thousands and thousands of dollars in just a few weeks and
> it will only take you an insignificant investment and a few
> minutes of your time.

Thanks for your very generous offer.  Such a wonderful opportunity
is too good not to share.  I'm sure you'll agree that there isn't
a group of hardworking, underpaid public servants more deserving
of such an opportunity than the fine folks at the US Postal
Inspection Office.  I'm passing your letter on to them in the hope
that the financial windfall generated by your techniques might
brighten their bleak existence.  I'm sure that after dealing with
sleazy frauds all day, they'll be happy to find a legitimate
method for generating "LOTS OF FAST AND EASY MONEY," especially
one thats limited to "honest people."

Regards,

XB

Anyone here with first- or second-hand knowledge of
working conditions at the Newberry Library in Chicago?
  Reply off list if you prefer.  Thanks!

__________________________________
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Avoid. I have been working here for some months, and it is a mess.

http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/010904/met_14496784.shtml

This is the latest bad news. Librarians do no collection
development , either.

I plan on leaving when the economy improves, or going back to non-
public library positions.

Save yourself a headache.

ContrarianlibrarianYou don't know me from Adam. :)!
The best counselors are the dead.
TER sad: Ill be back!.   http://www.oem-info.biz/ TERMINATOR prices for all!
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Croel Draw Graphics Suite 11 69$
See our big price list at http://www.oem-info.biz/ .
A good husband is healthy and absent.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From the article:

"The library planned to have 194 graduate-level librarians, which
officials said seemed high when compared to similar-sized libraries.
The freeze prohibits the library system from hiring about 25 graduate-
level librarians but doesn't prohibit the hiring of people with
bachelor's degrees. That could save the city about $450,000 for the
remainder of the fiscal year..."

Link:

http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/011704/met_14568260.shtml

More hiring unqualified people to work in libraries in FL.

Could you be more explicit about the patron's behavior?

(One possible strategy, if the MIP is threatening other
patrons is to have him barred from the library, assuming
your administration and the local constabulary will support
this).

XB

> Does anyone have strategies for dealing with hostile
> or unbalanced-acting mentally ill patrons in PLs?  We
> have recently been visited on several occasions by a
> guy who is living in a parallel universe, and, quite
> frankly, whose behavior is genuinely frightening.

If he is a danger to himself or others or gravely disabled (unable to care
for his basic needs), you might contact the mental health agency. He could
be in need of help and you would be doing him a favor to help him get it. In
most areas, one of these three categories will at least qualify him for
emergency evaluation.

JudyA


>From: "Xavier Bullwinkle" <xward7@...>

>
>Could you be more explicit about the patron's behavior?
>
>(One possible strategy, if the MIP is threatening other
>patrons is to have him barred from the library, assuming
>your administration and the local constabulary will support
>this).
>
>XB
>
> > Does anyone have strategies for dealing with hostile
> > or unbalanced-acting mentally ill patrons in PLs?  We
> > have recently been visited on several occasions by a
> > guy who is living in a parallel universe, and, quite
> > frankly, whose behavior is genuinely frightening.
>
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
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JudyA wrote:
> If he is a danger to himself or others or gravely
> disabled (unable to care
> for his basic needs), you might contact the mental
> health agency. He could
> be in need of help and you would be doing him a
> favor to help him get it.

To be contrarian --

I'm vehemently against the concept of "librarian as
social worker" and "librarians are here to rescue the
world".

Our role is not to "do him a favor" as you put it, but
instead to protect the interests and provide services
for the library.  If a patron is being obstreporous or
annoying, then call the police and have him removed.
If the person is ill, then call 911 for an ambulance.
If the person is well behaved and not a problem, then
he has every right to be in the library.

If libraries concentrated more on their primary
mission and less on these ancillary social welfare
types of activities, the identity of libraries would
be far clearer to both librarians and the outside world.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus

Um, if he is a danger to himself, etc. then he is proably ill.  Calling 911
is for life threatening emergencies. If the person is mentally ill, it
probably doesn't qualify and you would be taking services away from the
people whose lives are endangered. Calling the cops will probably result in
jailing rather than treatment. Or they will just remove him to have him come
back.

That doesn't solve the problem for the LIBRARY (God forbid we care about our
fellow human beings). If the person gets treatment, then they are less
likely to come back as a problem and more likely to come back treated for
their illness and a patron we can help as librarians.

If someone is just annoying, doesn't smell pretty, etc., but not otherwise a
problem, then leave him be. But the original post did say he was causing
fear.

Many mental health agencies respond to such situations (if funded).

Judy Anderson
www.cafeshops.com/vavlibrarian


>From: Chip Chop Plip Plop <kop001@...>

>

>To be contrarian --
>
>I'm vehemently against the concept of "librarian as
>social worker" and "librarians are here to rescue the
>world".
>
>Our role is not to "do him a favor" as you put it, but
>instead to protect the interests and provide services
>for the library.  If a patron is being obstreporous or
>annoying, then call the police and have him removed.
>If the person is ill, then call 911 for an ambulance.
>If the person is well behaved and not a problem, then
>he has every right to be in the library.
>
>If libraries concentrated more on their primary
>mission and less on these ancillary social welfare
>types of activities, the identity of libraries would
>be far clearer to both librarians and the outside world.
>

_________________________________________________________________
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Over the last few months I've been considering going to graduate
school to get a degree in library science.  I've never actually held
any library-related job, but I believe the environment might be
appropriate for me.  I'd like to work in a job centered on education
and information, but teaching is out of the question.  I don't have
the people skills or temperament to be the focal point of attention
for a bunch of people who often aren't even interested in learning,
and are simply in class either because it's the law or because
they're doing what's necessary to obtain a degree.  That's why a
library sounds more appealing.  I like the idea of working in a
place where people come out of their own desire to learn.  I like
the idea of a place where the acquisition of knowledge is of primary
importance, and everything doesn't revolve around the pursuit of
profits.  I like the fact that it's more of an open-ended
environment, where learning isn't restricted mostly to memorizing
factoids for a test.  Plus, the authoritarian aspect that's inherent
in teaching seems to be mostly absent in a librarian's work.

But I have to admit that I really don't know much about the
specifics of a librarian's job.  I'd certainly like to know about
some of the details of the field before I decide to devote time and
money towards education in it.  And that's why I'm here; I'm
searching for anything a librarian could tell me about his or her
job that would give me a better idea about whether or not the field
would be ideal for me.  What is the workday like for a librarian?
Does it mostly revolve around assisting people?  Or is it more
technical, and about maintaining up-to-date archives and the like?
Or can the details of the job vary tremendously from one place to
another?  What do you think is the most important thing about doing
well in the profession?  Which skills are vital to success, and
which are unnecessary?  What type of person do you think would be
best suited for a career in library?  How do you see the profession
changing in the future?  What do you really like or dislike about
your job?

If anyone could answer any of those questions, or just tell me
anything that would give me more information about the work of a
librarian, I would be most appreciative.

I'd suggest going to your local public library and checking in the USDL's
"Occupational Outlook Handbook"; also, talk with librarians in your
community--public, college, school, special.  Is there a MLS program near where
you live?  Then go talk to students and professors there.

It is impossible to give you a simple answer to your questions because there are
many different kinds of library and many kinds of librarians.

-----Original Message-----
From: wearyindignation [mailto:wearyindignation@...]
Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 9:07 PM
To: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [contrarianlibrarian] What's a career in library like?


Over the last few months I've been considering going to graduate
school to get a degree in library science.  I've never actually held
any library-related job, but I believe the environment might be
appropriate for me.  I'd like to work in a job centered on education
and information, but teaching is out of the question.  I don't have
the people skills or temperament to be the focal point of attention
for a bunch of people who often aren't even interested in learning,
and are simply in class either because it's the law or because
they're doing what's necessary to obtain a degree.  That's why a
library sounds more appealing.  I like the idea of working in a
place where people come out of their own desire to learn.  I like
the idea of a place where the acquisition of knowledge is of primary
importance, and everything doesn't revolve around the pursuit of
profits.  I like the fact that it's more of an open-ended
environment, where learning isn't restricted mostly to memorizing
factoids for a test.  Plus, the authoritarian aspect that's inherent
in teaching seems to be mostly absent in a librarian's work.

But I have to admit that I really don't know much about the
specifics of a librarian's job.  I'd certainly like to know about
some of the details of the field before I decide to devote time and
money towards education in it.  And that's why I'm here; I'm
searching for anything a librarian could tell me about his or her
job that would give me a better idea about whether or not the field
would be ideal for me.  What is the workday like for a librarian?
Does it mostly revolve around assisting people?  Or is it more
technical, and about maintaining up-to-date archives and the like?
Or can the details of the job vary tremendously from one place to
another?  What do you think is the most important thing about doing
well in the profession?  Which skills are vital to success, and
which are unnecessary?  What type of person do you think would be
best suited for a career in library?  How do you see the profession
changing in the future?  What do you really like or dislike about
your job?

If anyone could answer any of those questions, or just tell me
anything that would give me more information about the work of a
librarian, I would be most appreciative.




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Actually, the occupational outlook handbook is online now. For librarians:

http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos068.htm

The job varies greatly depending on where you work and the kind of
librarian. I'm an academic librarian, but I'm also the sole librarian, so I
do a bit of everything.

But you will still, public or academic, get the kids who have to do
assignments and are there because of that and not the joy of the pursuit of
knowledge. But there is reward when they come in all frustrated at not
finding information and you show them quickly how they can find what they
need.

When I was considering becoming a librarian, something like a fourth career
for me, I talked to lots of librarians. I also had never worked in a
library.

JudyA
Tillamook OR
www.cafeshops.com/vavlibrarian


>From: "Wilson, Bruce" <brucewilson@...>

>
>I'd suggest going to your local public library and checking in the USDL's
>"Occupational Outlook Handbook"; also, talk with librarians in your
>community--public, college, school, special.  Is there a MLS program near
>where you live?  Then go talk to students and professors there.
>
>It is impossible to give you a simple answer to your questions because
>there are many different kinds of library and many kinds of librarians.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: wearyindignation [mailto:wearyindignation@...]
>Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 9:07 PM
>To: contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [contrarianlibrarian] What's a career in library like?
>
>
>Over the last few months I've been considering going to graduate
>school to get a degree in library science.

_________________________________________________________________
Rethink your business approach for the new year with the helpful tips here.
http://special.msn.com/bcentral/prep04.armx

I have been employed for 1 1/2 years as an academic librarian.
My experience has been that there is some of that teaching element involved in
being a librarian. In fact, I tell people if they would consider going into
teaching, they should also consider library science. Much of the teaching
involves instructing students on database searching. Some instruction is done on
a one-on-basis and some in a group setting. Skill level varies from student to
student, ranging from students who don't know how to use a computer mouse, to
those who are very computer savvy.

I have also found that when it comes to libraries, size does indeed matter. Your
experience as a librarian in a very small library, (like the one I currently
work in) will be very different from that of a large state university system,
for example (which I have previously worked in.) A small library is a great
place to start your career because you learn various aspects of the profession,
where as in a larger library, you will most likley have limited job functions.

There are more isolated jobs functions, such as cataloging or archival work,
that you may find are suitable to your temperment and personality. I love
cataloging, and working in archives can be very cool, although a bit too
isolated.

I've never worked in a special library, (ie- a hospital library, a law library
or a business library), but I suspect there is a lot of that customer service
element, the customers  being the professionals you serve.

All in all it is a wonderful profession, and I can honestly say that I have a
great deal of pride in what I do for a living.

Good Luck to you

Michele Brancato Arcury

This one fellow is a clear schizophrenic.  He comes
into the library moving and talking a mile a minute,
and says irrational things.  He saw a dog outside one
day, and complained to the front desk that it was a
'wolf, out to get him because it was afraid he would
baptize him Christian'.  This man says all manner of
such things, and moves, as said, very quickly and
close to people.  He is unkempt, and clearly has space
in pockets, etc., where he might keep weapons.  I am
convinced he is off meds and, if he can fear the local
dog, who's to say what he would think I am, or am
planning to do to him?

There are, of course, numerous others that, either due
to mental illness, intoxication, or both, present
immediate challenges to the library staff, and threats
to their safety.  Police can be called, but they do
not have Star Trek transporter beams to arrive
instantaneously.

--- Xavier Bullwinkle <xward7@...> wrote:
> Could you be more explicit about the patron's
> behavior?
>
> (One possible strategy, if the MIP is threatening
> other
> patrons is to have him barred from the library,
> assuming
> your administration and the local constabulary will
> support
> this).
>
> XB
>
> > Does anyone have strategies for dealing with
> hostile
> > or unbalanced-acting mentally ill patrons in PLs?
> We
> > have recently been visited on several occasions by
> a
> > guy who is living in a parallel universe, and,
> quite
> > frankly, whose behavior is genuinely frightening.
>
>
>


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!
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We all want to preserve professional jobs, but many of
the tasks these BA paraprofessionals will be tasked
with are not those that need to be served by MLS (I am
an MLS, but I certainly have a job that could easily
be done by a community college grad, for instance, at
my PL).  Many PLs have experienced ongoing funding
crises; creating makework jobs for overpaid MLSs is
not the answer to this.  Increasing the standards of
library schools is, to lessen the glut of out of work
MLSs.

--- chimichanga700 <chimichanga700@...> wrote:
> From the article:
>
> "The library planned to have 194 graduate-level
> librarians, which
> officials said seemed high when compared to
> similar-sized libraries.
> The freeze prohibits the library system from hiring
> about 25 graduate-
> level librarians but doesn't prohibit the hiring of
> people with
> bachelor's degrees. That could save the city about
> $450,000 for the
> remainder of the fiscal year..."
>
> Link:
>
>
http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/011704/met_14568260.shtml
>
> More hiring unqualified people to work in libraries
> in FL.
>
>


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/

I used to work as a patient advocate in a state mental hospital. First, it
sounds more like he could be in a manic phase of manic depression, they get
delusional too. Not that it matters in how it affects the library. When one
is a therapist, you confront the delusions, but when I was an advocate, I
would kind of go along with them. Oh, the dog scares you, lets make sure you
are in a part of the library where he can't see you. Things like that. But
you are right about what his delusions might do. If he thinks you are his
buddy (you don't have to say that you see the same thing) it lessons the
potential danger. But staff often doesn't have time for that. That's why I
suggest, if he shows up reliably at a certain time/day, then see if the
mental health department can show up and do an emergency eval and get him
treated and out of your danger zone.

At my last library, we had an alcoholic. When sober, he was fine. When drunk
he could be very foul and mean. So they sat him down with a contract. It
said that if he behaved a certain way, the cops would be called. And it
would mean he couldn't use the library for a certain number of days,
increasing the number if he caused a repeat problem in x number of days.
Since we were across the street from city hall and a mile from the police
station, it was easy to get the cops there.

Harder to do with the mentally ill, but it's often done with them as well,
if you can catch him in a lucid moment. Not sure how they enforced the don't
show up stuff, since I was in cataloging and rarely saw Bill. They even had
a Bill log for incidents with him. I never had trouble, but I was probably
just lucky.

Judy


>From: Thomas Roche <tertullianus_2000@...>

>This one fellow is a clear schizophrenic.  He comes
>into the library moving and talking a mile a minute,
>and says irrational things.  He saw a dog outside one
>day, and complained to the front desk that it was a
>'wolf, out to get him because it was afraid he would
>baptize him Christian'.  This man says all manner of
>such things, and moves, as said, very quickly and
>close to people.  He is unkempt, and clearly has space
>in pockets, etc., where he might keep weapons.  I am
>convinced he is off meds and, if he can fear the local
>dog, who's to say what he would think I am, or am
>planning to do to him?
>
>There are, of course, numerous others that, either due
>to mental illness, intoxication, or both, present
>immediate challenges to the library staff, and threats
>to their safety.  Police can be called, but they do
>not have Star Trek transporter beams to arrive
>instantaneously.

_________________________________________________________________
Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high-speed
experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1

For some alternative views of life in library-land, you might want
to take a look at some of the older messages in this group.
Especially those with the subject line "From the Stealth Librarian
Archives."

XB


--- In contrarianlibrarian@yahoogroups.com, "wearyindignation"
<wearyindignation@y...> wrote:
> Over the last few months I've been considering going to graduate
> school to get a degree in library science.  I've never actually
held
> any library-related job, but I believe the environment might be
> appropriate for me.  I'd like to work in a job centered on
education
> and information, but teaching is out of the question.  I don't
have
> the people skills or temperament to be the focal point of
attention
> for a bunch of people who often aren't even interested in
learning,
> and are simply in class either because it's the law or because
> they're doing what's necessary to obtain a degree.  That's why a
> library sounds more appealing.  I like the idea of working in a
> place where people come out of their own desire to learn.  I like
> the idea of a place where the acquisition of knowledge is of
primary
> importance, and everything doesn't revolve around the pursuit of
> profits.  I like the fact that it's more of an open-ended
> environment, where learning isn't restricted mostly to memorizing
> factoids for a test.  Plus, the authoritarian aspect that's
inherent
> in teaching seems to be mostly absent in a librarian's work.
>
> But I have to admit that I really don't know much about the
> specifics of a librarian's job.  I'd certainly like to know about
> some of the details of the field before I decide to devote time
and
> money towards education in it.  And that's why I'm here; I'm
> searching for anything a librarian could tell me about his or her
> job that would give me a better idea about whether or not the
field
> would be ideal for me.  What is the workday like for a librarian?
> Does it mostly revolve around assisting people?  Or is it more
> technical, and about maintaining up-to-date archives and the
like?
> Or can the details of the job vary tremendously from one place to
> another?  What do you think is the most important thing about
doing
> well in the profession?  Which skills are vital to success, and
> which are unnecessary?  What type of person do you think would be
> best suited for a career in library?  How do you see the
profession
> changing in the future?  What do you really like or dislike about
> your job?
>
> If anyone could answer any of those questions, or just tell me
> anything that would give me more information about the work of a
> librarian, I would be most appreciative.