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Generalizing Peer Production into the Physical World   Message List  
Reply | Forward Message #6967 of 7047 |
Re: [decentralization] Generalizing Peer Production into the Physical World

> Can peer production really extend into the physical world, or does it
> rely on special features of the digital world?

...or, as a third thesis, will the physical world increasingly take on
the features of the digital world?

An increasing number of physical activities are becoming so
data-centric that the physical aspects are simply executional steps at
the end of a chain of digital manipulation. Cemex and Zara, the cement
and fashion companies, both re-tooled their working methods around
rapid handling of data. ZeroPrestige design kites with CAD, and has
them built overseas after perfecting a design. Gold Corp in Canada let
users figure out where they should dig next, using the geologic data
they exposed. Nokia increasingly ship phones with user-accesible APIs,
making them one of a growing class of object-oriented objects.

And so on.

I think peer production, at least as Yochai has described it, requires
the flexibility and economics of the digital, but an increasing number
of physical processes have significantly digital components.

-clay

>
> Is peer production really an exception to the rules, or is it a new name
> for an old thing?
>
> -Lucas
>
> (BTW, Christian worked for me a little ways back. He was a stellar
> developer and overall very sharp guy, so I'm inclined to give the
> benefit of the doubt to this project).
>
> Alen Peacock wrote:
> > Centrally planned economies
> > (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_economy) form a simple analog to
> > centralized system architectures. In that regard, truly decentralized
> > (p2p) systems share much more in common with the free market than do
> > their conterparts.
> >
> > But AFAIK, central control isn't limited to communism: cartel/monopoly
> > power is similarly centralized, or at least "highly concentrated."
> >
> > I should disclaim "IANAE," where E=economist, so feel free to correct
> > my broad generalizing (or forgive if I'm just stating the obvious).
> >
> > Alen
> >
> >
> > On Nov 4, 2007 3:57 PM, Scott Feamster <sf@...> wrote:
> >> Dear all,
> >>
> >> In his book Christian Siefkes argues that peer economies (sharing and
> >> cooperation) are better than market economies (property and competition).
> >> Siefkes also asserts that capitalism is drudgery whereas peer production is
> >> fun.
> >>
> >> However, history has already proven that market/capitalist economies are
> >> better than peer/communist economies, except for communist party bosses.
> >> Were communist gulags fun?
> >>
> >> Additionally, market economies allow for voluntary peer economies within
> >> them. Communist economies are command and control.
> >>
> >> I think Siefkes arguments support market/capitalist economies despite his
> >> protests. What do you think?
> >>
> >> In pursuit of wisdom,
> >> Scott
>
>
> Announce or discover P2P conferences on the P2P Conference Wiki at
> http://www.neurogrid.net/twiki/bin/view/Main/PeerToPeerConferences
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>



Mon Nov 5, 2007 7:30 pm

cshirky
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Message #6967 of 7047 |
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The site: http://peerconomy.org/ "So far, this new mode of production—peer production—has been limited to certain niches of production, such as information...
Lucas Gonze
lucas_gonze
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Nov 4, 2007
6:54 pm

Dear all, In his book Christian Siefkes argues that peer economies (sharing and cooperation) are better than market economies (property and competition). ...
Scott Feamster
sf@...
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Nov 4, 2007
10:57 pm

Centrally planned economies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_economy) form a simple analog to centralized system architectures. In that regard, truly...
Alen Peacock
alenlpeacock
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Nov 5, 2007
1:07 am

I have only read a few pages of this book so far, so my understanding is pretty limited, but I am pretty confident that it is not a case for communalism. That...
Lucas Gonze
lucas_gonze
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Nov 5, 2007
4:14 am

... ...or, as a third thesis, will the physical world increasingly take on the features of the digital world? An increasing number of physical activities are...
Clay Shirky
cshirky
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Nov 5, 2007
7:30 pm

... Fantastic point. The real world is becoming a bunch of I/O devices with computers in between. Pretty much everything can be conceived of as one or the...
Lucas Gonze
lucas_gonze
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Nov 9, 2007
1:35 am

Isn't the digital world part of the physical world? The world can also be categorized into two groups. * Tangible: software, hardware, nature,... * Intangible:...
Scott Feamster
sf@...
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Nov 9, 2007
2:48 am

Scott Feamster <sf@...> Thu, 8 Nov 2007 18:48:01 ... When datacentres are sucking up a significant chunk of available power, yes, definitely. It's...
Julian Bond
jbond23uk
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Nov 9, 2007
11:50 am

... Dude, it is pure naked hubris to think it's possible to wander off topic in a conversation that contains sustained lapses into silence going on for more...
Lucas Gonze
lucas_gonze
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Nov 9, 2007
3:59 pm

I feel safe in predicting that pretty much everything with a retail price over $25 will be connected to the internet some day soon. Here's one I'm finding...
Hugh Pyle
hfpyle
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Nov 9, 2007
7:43 pm

... I believe it was Vernadsky's Noosphere: http://www.metafilter.com/56565/History-of-a-meme - unless, of course, you are specifically referring to the parts...
Serguei Osokine
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Nov 9, 2007
5:27 pm

... Sure, other than that the world of things exists and the world of ideas doesn't....
Mike Dierken
mdierken
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Nov 10, 2007
6:39 am

Mike Dierken <dierken@...> Fri, 9 Nov 2007 22:39:40 ... Err, what? The World of Ideas certainly does exist. But I'm twisting the original ideas. The...
Julian Bond
jbond23uk
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Nov 10, 2007
6:15 pm

... EG, pi is implicit in every circular object. That makes it even more durable than the objects. ... Here is an example of seeping -- I have been playing...
Lucas Gonze
lucas_gonze
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Nov 10, 2007
7:55 pm

... But the Internet is physical (electrons, silicon, copper, glass fiber, etc) ideas are not. That's the "exists" I was referring to. The statement that...
Mike Dierken
mdierken
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Nov 11, 2007
5:32 am

Mike Dierken <dierken@...> Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:32:52 ... You're right of course. It's one of those trolls that sounds deep but doesn't actually say very...
Julian Bond
jbond23uk
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Nov 11, 2007
8:02 am

... More to play devil's advocate on a Sunday morning, than anything else... Are ideas indistinguishable from things, or vice versa? Ideas are often...
Miles Fidelman
mfidelman
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Nov 11, 2007
5:32 pm

In the middle, it's people among tangibles (sheet music and mics) and intangibles (thoughts and emotions). In the end, it's the intangibles that give our lives...
Scott Feamster
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Nov 11, 2007
10:44 pm

Scott Feamster <sf@...> Sun, 4 Nov 2007 14:57:16 ... This really isn't the forum but I couldn't let that pass without a comment. IMHO mixed...
Julian Bond
jbond23uk
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Nov 5, 2007
10:41 am

The conventional view remains that the choice is EITHER: (a) Public = State owned; OR (b) Private = "owned by a "Joint Stock Limited Liability Company" aka...
cjenscook
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Nov 5, 2007
4:07 pm

... Which completely leaves out: - non-profit (or non-governmental organization) - governed by either its membership or a board of trustees - cooperative...
Miles Fidelman
mfidelman
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Nov 7, 2007
11:40 pm

... Miles Fidelman replied ... either its membership or a board of trustees ... you think coops can't be effective businesses, check out the financials on...
cjenscook
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Nov 8, 2007
3:19 pm

Hi, guys, There are multiple ownership alternatives, not just two. If we want to group ownership into two groups, the following two might be more appropriate....
Scott Feamster
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Nov 8, 2007
3:46 pm

good points which leads to a question: other than academic discourse, is this topic leading anywhere, or have we talked it to death? :-)...
Miles Fidelman
mfidelman
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Nov 8, 2007
4:05 pm

... topic ... Now that's the spirit! I've only ever been interested in outcomes, and in problem solving. I observe a new "Capital Partnership" financing...
cjenscook
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Nov 8, 2007
11:43 pm

Hi, Chris and all, What Chris describes is equity capital that we call friends and family, angel, or venture capital investment in the U.S. Equity will...
Scott Feamster
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Nov 9, 2007
3:28 am

Hi Scott Although I'm based in Linlithgow, Scotland (birthplace of Mary, Queen of Scots) I'm not Scottish myself, just a mongrel. ... family, angel, or venture...
cjenscook
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Nov 12, 2007
1:45 am

... Well, yes, but... that's a somewhat fallacious point of view that's been pushed by vested interests and a cooperative media. It wasn't that long ago when...
Miles Fidelman
mfidelman
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Nov 8, 2007
4:03 pm
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