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The value of lead time   Message List  
Reply Message #14876 of 15655 |
Re: The value of lead time

There are two definitions of "cycle time" in usage in different areas of the
Lean space.

In moving line manufacturing "cycle time" is the time between each item rolling
off the line. In Little's Law this is essential the reciprocal of Throughput.
Hence, if we make a Corolla every 90 secs, we have a cycle time of 90s, and we
have a Throughput of 40 per hour. In Little's Law the Lead Time is the same as I
defined.

In job shops and in common language usage you could say the cycle time is the
time between any two points in the workflow. Cycle time is essentially a local
measure. Hence it needs to be qualified with limiters such as "cycle time
through development."

The usage of Cycle Time in GetKanban for example is as Bruce is using it and is
not aligned with Little's Law.

Given that there has been a lot of misunderstanding of this over the years, and
I have contributed to this, I now want to clean it up. As a result, Lean Kanban
University will publish a standard for it. I expect it will be several years
before we see everyone fall into line with it.

Regards,
David
http://djaa.com/

--- In kanbandev@yahoogroups.com, brucemount@... wrote:
>
> The definition below is what I have been calling "Cycle Time". Does this
mean:
>
>
> 1. Cycle Time and Lead Time are the same thing?
> 2. Cycle Time is something else entirely. If so, what?
>
>
> --Bruce





Tue Feb 14, 2012 1:45 pm

netherby_uk
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Message #14876 of 15655 |
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The definition below is what I have been calling "Cycle Time". Does this mean: 1. Cycle Time and Lead Time are the same thing? 2. Cycle Time is something...
brucemount@...
brucemount Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
10:53 am

There are two definitions of "cycle time" in usage in different areas of the Lean space. In moving line manufacturing "cycle time" is the time between each...
David Anderson
netherby_uk Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
1:45 pm

Another clarification, to combine with Lead Time. Lead Time is how long it takes an individual thing from start to finish. (And you need to define start to...
Jack Vinson
jackvinson Offline Send Email
Feb 14, 2012
6:32 pm

I see it as reducing risk. Things in the backlog can be changed, reordered, removed, or added to at the customer's whim. Once someone "picks up" the task,...
Ron Romero
ziroby Offline Send Email
Feb 16, 2012
6:40 pm

Good point, Nikolay. As I have posted here before, I believe that Software Kanban's dogmatic, over simplified, bureaucratic focus on lead time reduction is...
Jonathan
jon899jon Offline Send Email
Feb 18, 2012
8:58 am

Hi Jonathan, Nice post. This is the danger of reductionism. Oversimplification until we end up with over-simplistic models that no longer reflect reality. Yet...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 18, 2012
9:58 am

Mr Fadfree - and yet our profession is quite distinct/different from the two mentioned below even though all 3 harness creative elements. we must remind...
Eb
amaeze77 Offline Send Email
Feb 18, 2012
11:58 pm

Hi Eb, ... Would your testing stand up to peer review in any recognised scientific journal? Have you devised experiments that removes bias? Have you dealt with...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 19, 2012
5:27 am

Hi, Eb and Fadfree, Modeling in order to get a better understanding of it (software development) as the book at the end of chapter three advocates it is a way...
Helen Wu
bhwu98 Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
5:41 am

Hi Fadfree - When did your criteria become the basis for science? :) My understanding of "science" is simply the quest for knowledge via hypotheses and tests. ...
Eb
amaeze77 Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
10:28 am

Hi Eb, We need to be more precise: "Improve Collaboratively (using models/scientific method)" Is not the same as: "Improve collaboratively (using anecdote and...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 19, 2012
10:49 am

The results of a science fair are not published in academic journals, would we say that the kids are not conducting scientific experiments? I am not...
Eb
amaeze77 Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
11:05 am

Hi Eb, Like I say, we need to be more precise. Teaching science is not the same as doing science. Kids in school learning science aren't doing real science. In...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 19, 2012
11:21 am

Hey Fadfree actually they are learning the scientific method. interesting you feel comfortable using the word "experiment" to describe what you do. i guess...
Eb
amaeze77 Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
1:05 pm

Hi Eb, If you read the definition of the scientific method I supplied, you will see that it isn't the only method of inquiry possible. I can do other types of...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 19, 2012
1:57 pm

Hi Fadfree - Now we are going in circles. Even those you would specifically classify as scientists suffer from self affirmation bias. Should we take the...
Eb
amaeze77 Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
2:05 pm

Hi Eb, Real scientist design their experiments to remove bias :) I'm happy agreeing to disagree. Fad free....
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 19, 2012
2:26 pm

I feel sure that this discussion is off topic. R ... Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com Before you contradict an old man, my fair friend, you should endeavor to...
RonJeffries
ronaldejeffries Offline Send Email
Feb 19, 2012
8:56 pm

Although I think the experimenting that is happening using Kanban method may not pass the scrutiny of the scientific world, a lot of the principles we use are...
Tony Lew
sankwon Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
4:56 pm

Assuming "scientific" were the wrong word for what we are doing, what would we then do differently? Although I too am a bit pedantic about terminology I tend...
Adam Sroka
adamjaph Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
5:03 pm

Hi Adam, ... I think language is very important. We think with language, and language and thought are closely related. Interestingly "science" and "scientific...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 20, 2012
7:48 pm

... I agree, but you appear to have ignored my question. What would you do differently? Also, what would you call it? Would you agree that, even if it is not ...
Adam Sroka
adamjaph Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
8:03 pm

Does this list have a moderator? If not, I'd be willing to serve. R ... Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com Before you contradict an old man, my fair friend, you...
RonJeffries
ronaldejeffries Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
9:06 pm

Hi Adam, ... I thought I answered it. ... As a profession we would be more artful in our approach. Have you read Artful Making by Austin and devin?: ...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 20, 2012
9:25 pm

I think you are reading too much into it. When we talk about using the scientific method in Lean/Kanban all that we mean is this: 1. Measure the system 2....
Adam Sroka
adamjaph Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
9:46 pm

Hi Adam, Yes i know its only a metaphor. We are discussing whether it is the right metaphor. ... Yes. Actors, Musicians, and just about every creative...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 20, 2012
9:59 pm

I do sense a litte negative tone from some posters but i could be totally off - hard to tell these things from email alone. Honestly, i do think discussion on...
Tony Lew
sankwon Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
10:25 pm

Hi Tony, ... Enjoy them. I'm leaving the group. Which I never do. Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com There's no word for accountability in Finnish....
RonJeffries
ronaldejeffries Offline Send Email
Feb 20, 2012
10:40 pm

Jonathan: Perhaps you are unaware of the concept of "swim lanes" where, indeed, some things move fast and other moves slow, which as you say, makes sense....
brucemount@...
brucemount Offline Send Email
Feb 18, 2012
10:18 am

Hi Bruce, ... Is this fair? The Kanban community makes great play over applying the "scientific method". In fact it is called out as a core practice. My view...
fadfreedev Offline Send Email Feb 18, 2012
11:12 am
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