A number of threads about pricing prompted me to look for a web based
'blue book' for used boats. I found one at < http://www.nadaguides.com/
>. I can't vouch for accuracy (your mileage, and your pocketbook may vary), but
it is a place to start.

Paul Windt
W27 WENDOR ..... in the water....SOON!

There is an excellent source of pricing information that I have used in the
past. It is published by BUC RESEARCH; address: 1314 Northeast 17th Court,
Fort Lauderdale, FL. 33305, 1-800-3276929. This is available in a public
library much like you find for used cars. If you request pricing information
at the above phone number, it is expensive. So, the library is the first
choice for me. Good luck and if you are not successful at the library, post a
message to me with the boat particulars (outboard or Diesel model,
electronics, accessories,etc) and year and I will try to get the information.
It may not be the current year but past addition prices may be helpful. As a
note, we all tend to underprice our boats according to the BUC publication.
Fair winds

Dale Cuddeback

Another Good Yanmar dealer is Old Lyme Marina in Old Lyme , CT verry helpful
and fortunatly for me about 5 miles away.  They boast one of the largest
Yanmar volume dealers in the Northeast and I believe it. It is like going to
an auto parts store that has 5 to 6 complete new engines in the show room.
The number is (860) 434-1272 web site www.oldlymemarina.com

Youngest son drove his 87 Mustang into a ditch this weekend (has had
car all of one week).  Repair estimates run from $3,500 to $4,100.  Have had
to cancel out the Kentucky Lake vacation scheduled for 17 to 23 June.  I
guess that's what Dads are for.
	 Did not get to Lanier this weekend, but the nipple on the top of the
centerboard box has come lose and I am getting a little bit of water in the
cabin when I sail in a chop.  Will try to epoxy it back in this weekend.
Boat has sailed real well, must be the new bottom and the reconditioned
sails.  Will have to consider New main sail for next year.  Still having
problems with the motor.  It ran great in the shop.  Got it on the boat and
it did not want to run and later to start.  A small clip came off the choke
lever (where it attaches to the top of the carb.  Guess I flooded/wet the
plug.  Will try again this weekend.  Anyone with a Watkins on Lake Lanier?
Interested in some doubles sailing?
Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: peter young [mailto:steelboat@...]
Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 1:33 PM
To: watkins@egroups.com
Subject: [watkins] RE: Happy Memorial Day Weekend Watkins Sailing
Adventures



Greetings from Watkins 27 Paramour in Fort Myers.

I read all the spring boat repair work posts and send greetings to those
exited folks preparing for the start of sailing season. I think some of the
land locked will be at Ky. Lake.

A number of us will be sailing the Pine Island area of Sanibel and Captiva.

Here is where we'll be going

http://www.tween-waters.com

http://www.useppa.com

In case you ever down this way... keep'm in mind.

have a great weekend.

Peter



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The list has been quiet.  Everybody must be out enjoying their
sailboats.  Wish I was.  Mine is going in this weekend and
the anticipation is great.   Lots of repairs, lots of maitainence,
and I hope she floats again this year.  If anyone will be in
the Newburyport Massachussetts area let me know and we can
sail to the Isle of SHoals together.  Haven't done it solo yet,
maybe this year.  I hope this last noreaster is the last one
for a while.  Hi Kim!

Scott J. Poesse
Emerald Gale(I didn't name her, nor am I Irish)
Watkins 27, 1980

I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone give me
the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23?  Thanks.

-Dave Hanks

Not I.  I stripped the bottom and found the place where the pin goes, but it
was sealed and I could not see it.  The whole was a bit larger that a
quarter.  I don't even know if the pin screws into a socket, or rest in a
bushing or if a special tool is needed to extract it.  Does the pin rotate
with the board or does the board rotate around the pin.  Sure would hate to
punch a hole in the port side of the keel to try and punch the pin out to
then find out it screwed in and out.  Does anyone have an old owners manuel?
Did they even make one?  Is there some place where boat manufactures have to
submit their technical information?  Or can any Tom, Dick or Larry just
start building a boat that could put peoples lives in danger thru poor
design or materials?  Surely there is some agency, state or Federal that has
oversight over the boat building industry.
Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: madchariot@... [mailto:madchariot@...]
Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2000 3:30 PM
To: watkins@egroups.com
Subject: [watkins] Spare Centerboard Pin


I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone give me

the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23?
Thanks.

-Dave Hanks

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I just remembered, that some other manufacture bought the hull molds for the
23.  I want to say Compac, or Precision, or I think SeaCraft!!??  They may
have the technical information as they could be using the same keel
configuration.  Be interesting to see if they are using the same kickup
rudder system or came up with a better design.

Paul L.

-----Original Message-----
From: madchariot@... [mailto:madchariot@...]
Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2000 3:30 PM
To: watkins@egroups.com
Subject: [watkins] Spare Centerboard Pin


I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone give me

the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23?
Thanks.

-Dave Hanks

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I just put my centerboard back in.
The pin is stainless steel, 1 inch diameter, about 6 inches long,
thats a guess on the length as I didn't have a reasom to check it.
just carry a hacksaw and adjust it :)
Hope it helps.
Terry


catfish: icq #20116127


On Thu, 8 Jun 2000 madchariot@... wrote:

> I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone give me
> the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23?  Thanks.
>
> -Dave Hanks
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> CLICK HERE***SPECIAL OFFER***$60 in FREE calls
> ***SPECIAL OFFER***CLICK HERE
> http://click.egroups.com/1/4558/10/_/5261/_/960492585/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>

One last note.
the pin is just that a pin not screwed etc.
just held in from the filler on both sides,
I filled mine back in with Dynaglass after refinishing the centerboard,


catfish: icq #20116127

-----Original Message-----
From: T. Martin <catfish@...>
To: watkins@egroups.com <watkins@egroups.com>
Date: Friday, June 09, 2000 11:52 PM
Subject: Re: [watkins] Spare Centerboard Pin

I just put my centerboard back in.
The pin is stainless steel, 1 inch diameter, about 6 inches long,
thats a guess on the length as I didn't have a reasom to check it.
just carry a hacksaw and adjust it :)
Hope it helps.
Terry


catfish: icq #20116127


On Thu, 8 Jun 2000 madchariot@... wrote:

> I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone give me
> the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23?  Thanks.
>
> -Dave Hanks
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> CLICK HERE***SPECIAL OFFER***$60 in FREE calls
> ***SPECIAL OFFER***CLICK HERE
> http://click.egroups.com/1/4558/10/_/5261/_/960492585/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>

---

---

The pin was out when I bought the boat.
  All that was required to get it out was use a small grinder. Like a die
grinder and remove the filler.
  Thats all the previous owner did. The pin fits the hole but is not a
press fit so it can be pulled with your fingers once the wieght of the
swing board is lifted,
  Caution the swing board is really heavy about 150 to 200 lbs so please
don't get hurt.
Terry


catfish: icq #20116127


On Sat, 10 Jun 2000, Paul Lapointe wrote:

> Terry, what did you have to do to extract the pin?
> Paul L.
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: T. Martin <catfish@...>
>     To: watkins@egroups.com <watkins@egroups.com>
>     Date: Friday, June 09, 2000 11:52 PM
>     Subject: Re: [watkins] Spare Centerboard Pin
>
>
>     I just put my centerboard back in.
>     The pin is stainless steel, 1 inch diameter, about 6 inches long,
>     thats a guess on the length as I didn't have a reasom to check it.
>     just carry a hacksaw and adjust it :)
>     Hope it helps.
>     Terry
>
>
>     catfish: icq #20116127
>
>
>     On Thu, 8 Jun 2000 madchariot@... wrote:
>
>     > I'm interested in making a spare pin for my centerboard.  Can anyone
give me
>     > the dimensions and materials of the centerboard pin for a Watkins 23? 
Thanks.
>     >
>     > -Dave Hanks
>     >
>     > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     > CLICK HERE***SPECIAL OFFER***$60 in FREE calls
>     > ***SPECIAL OFFER***CLICK HERE
>     > http://click.egroups.com/1/4558/10/_/5261/_/960492585/
>     > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     >
>     >
>     >
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

Most of the work is over here in McDonough Georgia and in a few daysI will be
taking the my little 25 to the Bahammas for the summer.Since time is getting
short I will be trailering to West palm, FlaThen leaving there on 7-1-00 non
stop to Abaco. Green Turtle Kay onthe 3rd then with the regatta around Abaco.
What a great time thiswill be !!! (If you read back a few months ago I am the
guy who wasconsideing a watkins 25 and asked about the Seawolf name.) My
littleWatkins is like new and I hope I have no problems since this will bethe
first time I have had this boat in the water. Usually luck iswith me and I think
I have thought of every thing.I have made severalcrossings but consider my self
a sailor with alot to learn. If any ofyou are around Abaco in July please look
me up. I would love to meetyou and show you my boat. The boat name is Wild
Thang. Don't laughthat's the name that came with the boat and as hard as I try I
can'tthink of a great name. Just listen for the repetative Jimmy Buffitmusic and
look for the professional beer drinkers.     Happy sailing !!     Allen

Robert-
you used to have detailed sail plans from
a do-it-yourself outfit on the home page.
Didn't see them - did they object?
Mitch

Hi,

We just signed up as new members.  We have a 1981 Watkins 36CC which
we have happily owned for 11 years.

We would like to communicate with other 36CC owners concerning
upgrades, problems, etc.

Thank you,

"Tropic Isle"

Allen,

   Wish you a great sail in your Watkins 25.  A bit of advice from a Watkins
25 sailor:  Reef early and remember the wind usually blows the strongest out
of the direction you are heading. Have fun!

Bob


________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

My Watkins 25 is now out for maintenance and I discovered that my rudder
shaft may be bent slightly inside of the rudder and request a measurement
from another Watkins 25.  I need to know the vertical clearance between the
hull and the forward most point of the rudder when the rudder is along the
centerline of the boat. If a fellow owner has their boat out of the water
and could send me an e-mail with this I would greatly appreciate it.

I think this happened a few years ago when the boat went through a severe
thunderstorm while anchored in shallow water.  Even though it appears bent
from below, the rudder shaft looks straight above the rudder and the boat
still sails well.

Thanks for any help this group can give.

Bob

Watkins 25  in  North Carolina
e-mail:   ad4mz@...


________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

Hello,
Any fellow  29  owners  out  there  know the  manufacturer of the
windows?? It's not  Gray  like  on the  27's

After much boat searching I just bought a 1979 Watkins 27. So far I
am delighted. The boat is in great shape.  I sail out of Victoria,
B.C., and as you may know this is an incredible place to cruise.  I
was wondering if anyone is into a boat exchange with you coming up
here for 2 - 4 weeks (in summer or fall) in exchange for time on your
boat (in winter in a warm location like florida). Let me know!

Bob,
Can't help with measurements, but suggest that, if your marina has a moisture
meter, you try
getting a reading on the rudder. If it was subject to heavy impact it may have
affected the
shaft to rudder seal, with water intrusion resulting.  Something similar
happened to me.
Bob from NJ

Bob Cooley wrote:

> My Watkins 25 is now out for maintenance and I discovered that my rudder
> shaft may be bent slightly inside of the rudder and request a measurement
> from another Watkins 25.  I need to know the vertical clearance between the
> hull and the forward most point of the rudder when the rudder is along the
> centerline of the boat. If a fellow owner has their boat out of the water
> and could send me an e-mail with this I would greatly appreciate it.
>
> I think this happened a few years ago when the boat went through a severe
> thunderstorm while anchored in shallow water.  Even though it appears bent
> from below, the rudder shaft looks straight above the rudder and the boat
> still sails well.
>
> Thanks for any help this group can give.
>
> Bob
>
> Watkins 25  in  North Carolina
> e-mail:   ad4mz@...
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> beMANY! has a new way to save big on business calls. Click here and keep
saving every month.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/4118/10/_/5261/_/960776927/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

fixed windows or opening ports?

another ports page from the Irwin Owners homepage:


http://www.angelfire.com/fl/irwinsailboats/ports.html

they did not object, the link changed and we lost the specs cause I
didn't think to cut and paste the info......

the original link was from:

http://www.sailrite.com/


When I discovered sailrites specs page had been changed I looked for it
at their site but couldn't find it, so I search the web and found
another source, and cut and paste the info so we would not lose it again
, approx rig specs are also included at each of the specs pages at the
Homepage,

rig specs:

http://www.angelfire.com/fl/watkinssailboats/rigspecs.html

I taught myself to sew, have done  sail repairs and bimini restiching,
no major projects yet...
My basic sears sewing machine is all thats needed for  a blownseam or a
bimini but when you get a bunch of layers (like at the mast head) I tend
to bend or brake lots of needles.
A standard sized bimini  can take an incredible amount of thread seems
like I am always filling the  bobbins, especially the lower-- seems odd
they don't make them bigger !!

Watkins Owners Homepage

http://www.angelfire.com/fl/watkinssailboats/

Got a project in Mind ???

-----Original Message-----
From: tropicislemacaws@... [mailto:tropicislemacaws@...]
Sent: Sunday, June 11, 2000 5:41 PM
To: watkins@egroups.com
Subject: [watkins] new member

Hi,

We just signed up as new members.  We have a 1981 Watkins 36CC which
we have happily owned for 11 years. 

We would like to communicate with other 36CC owners concerning
upgrades, problems, etc.

Thank you,

"Tropic Isle"

---

---

Hello,
  Does anyone have a contact number for whats left of Watkins.
  I'm in a pickle since my W23 doesn't have a serial # I can't register it
and I need some help.
Terry

catfish: icq #20116127

Robert,

Thank you for your advice but I have the boat on stands in my backyard far
from a marine.  I do believe I have water intrusion into the rudder.  What
repair methods did you use.  I think I remember reading awhile back where
someone had to drill holes into the rudder and inject epoxy, maybe that was
you. There is a 3 inch gouge in the top of the rudder so I am sure water got
in there.

With the Watkins factory long closed I don't know where to turn for repair
help.  Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks

Bob


>From: Robert Edwards <edwardsr@...>
>Reply-To: watkins@egroups.com
>To: watkins@egroups.com
>Subject: Re: [watkins] Watkins 25 (Measurement Request)
>Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2000 07:30:16 -0400
>
>Bob,
>Can't help with measurements, but suggest that, if your marina has a
>moisture meter, you try
>getting a reading on the rudder. If it was subject to heavy impact it may
>have affected the
>shaft to rudder seal, with water intrusion resulting.  Something similar
>happened to me.
>Bob from NJ
>
>Bob Cooley wrote:
>
> > My Watkins 25 is now out for maintenance and I discovered that my rudder
> > shaft may be bent slightly inside of the rudder and request a
>measurement
> > from another Watkins 25.  I need to know the vertical clearance between
>the
> > hull and the forward most point of the rudder when the rudder is along
>the
> > centerline of the boat. If a fellow owner has their boat out of the
>water
> > and could send me an e-mail with this I would greatly appreciate it.
> >
> > I think this happened a few years ago when the boat went through a
>severe
> > thunderstorm while anchored in shallow water.  Even though it appears
>bent
> > from below, the rudder shaft looks straight above the rudder and the
>boat
> > still sails well.
> >
> > Thanks for any help this group can give.
> >
> > Bob
> >
> > Watkins 25  in  North Carolina
> > e-mail:   ad4mz@...
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________________
> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > beMANY! has a new way to save big on business calls. Click here and keep
>saving every month.
> > http://click.egroups.com/1/4118/10/_/5261/_/960776927/
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

I am almost positive that Watkins got thier rudders from Foss Foam in
Clearwater, Fl (727) 571 3626. There was an letter in the May 15 Practical
Sailor from Bob Walker of Foss Foam Products. You should call him and see if
they can make you another one he states that a off the transom rudder runs
$300 - $700 and a a 27 style rudder starts at about $700. He urges the reader
to call before you attempt a repair as often a new one is cheaper then a
repair job.  I am assuming he is speaking of a yard repair.  I repaired a
badly cracked rudder on my 27 for myself for about $150, but the shape is not
correct any more.  If I have a problem down the road I will buy a
replacement.
My repair involved  grinding open the cracks, letting  it dry for a few weeks
(more time here is better) filled the cracks with west and the adhesive
filler, wrapped it in a sheet of glass ( ground into the foam in a lot of
places so I felt like I needed a full sheet of glass in the new skin).  More
resin, some fairing mix. sanding , sanding,  and more sanding,  barrier coat
and paint.  It is now fairly solid but the shape is not correct but it wasn't
correct before either.  I am sure it will be fine at the speeds a w27 goes at.

Brian Hautaniemi
Wendor, 82, W27

Bob,
Brian's reply sounds like good advice to me.  I can add that a test for a really
wet rudder is
to drill a small hole, maybe 1/4", through the fiberglass somewhere on the
rudder where you
suspect water might be, and see what comes out.  Can be plugged with fairing
compound later.  Or
drill in a little farther and take a look at the foam that comes out.
A surveyor told me that on some rudders, the water intrusion causes rust or
corrosion on the
internal metal parts.  Most rudders have "flags" or tabs that are welded to the
main rudder
shaft and they are then embedded in the foam.  If they go bad you can lose your
steering
unexpectedly.  In my case I had the people gouge out an area to reveal some of
the internal
metal and welds.  Everything was ok, and the internal stainless steel was good,
so in a way it
was a waste, but several people have told me that some rudders are regular
carbon steel inside,
and if they get soaked they can go pretty fast.
My problem was not on my Watkins 27, so I'm talking generally.
Maybe someone in the group has torn their Watkins rudder down?

Bob from NJ


>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bob, My boat will be here at my house for about another week. Iwould like to
give you any measurments you may need. I am not sureexzactly what measurments
you need now but please feel free to e-mailme abeav@...  If my rudder is
pointing strait ahead there is 3/4 inch clearancefrom the forward top of the
rudder to the bottom of the boat and 1.25clearance in the rear. Hope this helps
!  Let me know.  Allen